Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

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ikea_femme
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Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by ikea_femme »

This is a 2005 Baja Turbo with a 4EAT "Sport Shift" transmission:

Context: Yesterday, I was excited to drive my car after having it in pieces for a timing belt job and radiator swap for the better part of a month. I pulled the battery and windshield wiper fluid pump/reservoir at one point to make room and see if I could do the spark plugs while I was doing everything else, decided not to, and in my haste to get the battery and wiper reservoir back in, I didn't line up one of the metal battery holder screws to the spot on the car's frame under the plastic tray. Dumb, I know.

I also found a black plastic connector next to the windshield wiper fluid's pump connector that didn't seem to connect to anything, and despite looking all over, I can't see what it goes to. I'm assuming the wiring harness is stock, although the previous owner has clearly wired some stuff in, including a hefty inline fuse and power wire wired directly to the terminals that goes past the firewall. My assumption is it was for a big subwoofer or something but I'm too scared to guess and take it out.

I dropped my friend off at the airport in the afternoon after driving the car just fine for some errands and refilling the ATF fluid because it ran low and threw an overheating fluid code (I guess when I drained the atf pan and changed the radiator and refilled by the dipstick, there was less in the pan after I drove and it got back in the radiator and rest of the transmission's works?).

On the way home from the airport, a car in front of me braked hard on the highway in an exit lane, so I braked hard as well and came to a complete stop. My engine stalled, which was odd because I wasn't having any idling or misfire issues. Then, I tried to start it again. It didn't work. I put my hazards on and called 911 to alert them I'd stalled on a busy street, and wondered if my fuel pump relay went bad or something. I then had my car towed home instead of to a shop, which was kinda dumb in hindsight. I guess I thought it would just be a fuse or something.

Diagnosis so far: My fuel pump makes a normal electric motor noise when the car is in ON. I also tried punching the seat above the fuel pump to see if that trick to jostle a clogged filter/stuck pump working would do. I'm a bit spooked to mess with the fuel pump too much because I have a full tank of gas. So I think that part is okay. I don't know how to test the fuel injectors and don't have a fuel pressure gauge. I could get to autozone and borrow that. I could also borrow a compression tester if my timing belt job somehow bent the valves, but the engine was running perfectly normally until I braked hard and it stalled. I looked at the fuel pump fuse and it looked fine. I tried starting the car with it pulled just to see what would happen, and I heard nothing different. The starter noises sound normal to me, and I took the timing belt cover off to make sure the cam gears are turning normally, and they are.

I then suspected the battery might have shifted backwards and bumped into the fuse box/wiring harness, and tried looking at the biggest connectors near the battery terminals, and they looked clean and not corroded, and I tried double checking the grounds near the battery by unscrewing the bolted-on grounds, sanding where they touch the body and the terminals themselves, and attaching them back. No luck. I also tried a jump box to see if it was low voltage since the battery is sagging a bit from so many crank attempts. That didn't help either.

I strongly suspect something is messing with the fuel injectors or the ignition system but I don't know what, and I only have a Fixd brand bluetooth ODB2 scanner. It's not read any codes while I've tried to crank the engine (I cleared them after refilling the ATF). Would any of these things definitely throw codes on a mid-range scanner like mine so I can rule them out?

Are there any other easy things I could try to fix this? Or should I just take the L and have it towed to a reputable shop? The worst part is the tow truck wasn't able to maneuver into my short driveway and dropped it off in front of my driveway and street cleaning day is coming up, so I'm working outside when it's getting cold, and will probably owe a small ticket to the city if I can't get it moving.
ikea_femme
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Re: Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by ikea_femme »

I also don't smell gas when I try to start it but maybe that's just how it is when the engine doesn't sense itself firing? If this is a big sign, I might go ahead and order a fuel pump assembly from Bosch on RockAuto, because it looks like Subaru no longer makes OEM ones and I want to save on parts/labor even if I do have a shop put it in.

I have offset wrenches so I probably can get the coil-on-boot things out to test them arcing to ground with a remote start and taping the boot near something grounded. I have new NGK spark plugs I haven't put in because I want to not introduce the variable of "installed the new ones possibly wrong" to the mix.
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Guacamole
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Re: Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by Guacamole »

I am not a mechanic and I don't know jack about transmission repair. If the fuel pump is working and assuming the rest of the electrical works then it's likely not related to the battery or any other electrical. That said, you mentioned it threw a code transmission code and you had to replace the fluid. According to this post (https://www.subaruoutback.org/threads/s ... op.201721/), this person had a similar problem and the issue turned out to be the torque converter.
Some other corroborating posts:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Cartalk/commen ... _breaking/
https://legacygt.com/forums/showthread. ... 4e223e&
https://www.subaruforester.org/threads/ ... ll.806666/

Not saying this is it but good place to start.
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ikea_femme
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Re: Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by ikea_femme »

I hope not but I'll be sure to consider it! Would a bad torque converter itself stop the engine from starting? If it was seized, wouldn't it not let the engine crank much at all and make an awful noise, and if it was just spinning without transferring power wouldn't it be like I'm in neutral?

I'm not super familiar with the technology tho. I guess if they just make it really hard to crank it'd not necessarily seem odd while cranking...
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Guacamole
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Re: Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by Guacamole »

No idea. I am out of my league here. Hopefully one of the mechanics here can be more helpful than I.
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joedavex
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Re: Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by joedavex »

Have you checked for spark?
It is a PIA with our turbos, you have to pull a coil pack to test with.
If you had thrown the timing belt or jumped time it would throw a code while cranking for the cam position sensor.
I don't remember if we have the schraeder valve inline on our fuel lines (I think we do), if so then it's an easy test to see if you have fuel there.
I don't think transmission/torque converter issues with cause a crank-no start situation.
Let us know how you make out and any more details that might lead to better diagnostics.
Good luck,
Joe
Gray 05 Turbo AT
Silver 04 Turbo AT
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ikea_femme
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Re: Stalled during a hard brake, now cranks and won't start?

Post by ikea_femme »

Hi, sorry for the late update! I ended up getting my car towed to a shop (it would have been illegally parked during construction if I didn't and nobody wanted to help push it away, and I was feeling overwhelmed) and it turns out somehow the timing belt jumped during the stop. I don't think it was bad parts, because I used an Aisin timing belt and water pump kit. I'm not sure what I did wrong, but I'm incredibly embarrassed. I guess this is one of those hard lessons you get early on working on a car.

Anyway, I'm super lucky because the engine still works fine with a new belt. So, this was entirely a noobie mistake, or maybe, MAYBE a bad tensioner (I wouldn't know, I tried to prime it but with a c-clamp instead of a vice, which was super awkward).

Also, the transmission is running a lot smoother now, so I don't think it's dying. I'm doing another drain and fill on it, though, just because the fluid still looks a bit brownish, and I don't know if it was me or the shop but the transmission fluid is at the low mark for hot when it's cold (I definitely didn't fill it that high myself, but maybe this is some quirk of how the levels settle after driving?). I caught it after driving about 200 miles, so if that much extra is dangerous short term, I guess the damage is done now if there was any, but I've had zero new issues. I'm also going to try adding TransX to see if that helps the gaskets in the trans last longer and if it helps it shift faster between 1 and 2 and shifting between park/drive and reverse/drive. (I know transx speeding up shifts to drive are more a '99 4eat thing, but I'm not going to dig around for solenoids or anything just yet)

So, everything is good now!
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